China DOS Union

Just need an e-book for learning DOS. Starting from 0. Thanks!

Hmm, first of all. How can an e-book made by CDU use CHM and similar formats????????
Wouldn't that make it impossible to read under DOS?

Free distribution is absolutely correct. Wouldn't it be even better to put it under GPL? Allow modification, allow free redistribution.
But don't allow modification of the copyright notice.

A DOS boot disk definitely has to be included, and that WIN98 MINI version can be included too. The articles should be no more than 10M,
WIN98MINI is about 60M, and WIN3。XMINI is only about 2M or so

, the FREEDOS system (full set) is about 100M.

The full DJGPP system
(this package is basically a UNIX FOR DOS package, EMACS, BASH,
it's all there.)

The solution I imagine is:

1. Use FREE DOS as the boot system, in order to promote it.
And also to avoid violating copyright law. This is the technology the webmaster and everyone
are most familiar with (I'm not too familiar with it)

2. Use DJGPP or a FREE DOS application package as the application package on the system / or use GUI interfaces such as CUBE (all three
options have drawbacks. DJGPP...... really doesn't feel like DOS, but it's extremely stable. FREE DOS is quite good, unfortunately
it crashes a bit too often. Other GUI interfaces have strict requirements for users' computers, just like many computers can boot the LINUX text
interface, but have a hard time booting X WINDOWS.

3. Chinese character support system (I'm not familiar with this area either, depressing; it seems there are some free
Chinese character support systems, but.... they're not all that stable, or they conflict with the webmaster's DOS boot disk)

4. Help system: the most important system, and it definitely must be in Chinese.
As for the source of the help, of course it should be CDU's articles.
This is also our advantage: we have a large number of original articles.

5. Printing system: although users may just want to use our disc to play around with DOS, we can also give them a pleasant
surprise by recommending the famous and professional TEX typesetting system.

6. Network system: under DOS there is no browser that truly supports Chinese (depressing), so this is a blank area. (Although
WIN3。X can fill this gap, I really think burning copyrighted software is not good) I heard JAVAPC can run under DOS, so has the most famous browser under JAVA been ported? Webmaster?

Other network programs are more like a hacker's toolbox.

8. Programming environment: PYTHON, JAVA, DJGPP, free BASIC compiler, BISON, GAWK, PERL
all of these can be included (I roughly calculated it, about 200M would be needed)

9. Other: I don't know what else is needed, everyone think about it more!!!

PS: Add LILO booting? (Does it support CDs? I don't know)

Chinese documentation (archiving and organizing) plan:

I see many friends want to organize the documentation, so I took a rough look. At the current stage, the existing documents could be organized manually by two people within 1 week.

But I always feel that doing it this way isn't solid enough. Because that is not good for future work.

So I hope to establish a document archiving system (){
1. Document database??? Hehe, nothing that mysterious!;
2. Expert system???? Who's going to make that!!!! Nobody has the energy for it;
3. Index-based manager??? There are already such things under WINDOWS, hehe;
}

Advantages:
1. This system can generate plain text, HTML, or other "clean formats" for other uses.
2. Authors and modification times can be tracked.
3. For translated files, it can generate simple proofreading versions, making things convenient for everyone.
4. It can do simple maintenance of hyperlinks in files (good for the webmaster and for everyone.)

Implementation:
0. Since no one has the energy to make a complete system, we should still follow UNIX philosophy: make each small tool the best it can be, then RESTRUCT IT.

1. For the first point under "Advantages" (features?? requirement analysis?), markup languages can be used to implement it. TEX,
INFO, and similar systems can all do this themselves. There are also many systems like PERLDOC and JAVADOC that can achieve
this goal.

2. RCS is enough, since we don't have the energy to set up a CVS server. (Or the simplest method is to use
MAKE or something even leaner, letting DIFF/FC generate reports, then use batch files to combine everything

3. There is already ready-made free software under DOS, TT。EXE, a work by Fengyun. I use it to translate DJGPP
articles.

4. A simple PERL script can scan HTML files, generate a list, and then use FLASH GET's full-download
function to check links. This way, all the links in everyone's articles can be effectively
verified. Combined with MAKE, it can even do regular incremental checks. This kind of fine work.

PS: That's why I have to admire UNIX philosophy. Nearly everything is ready-made; just combine it and you can put
documentation, links within documentation, document archiving, and a whole series of related tasks under command-line control.
Of course, if you combine it, then do a lot more debugging, debugging, and add a GUI, it becomes publishable software.

PSPS: This is only an idea of mine, none of it has been implemented yet. Anyone interested, let's discuss it together!

Current DOS software is either copyrighted or very old, aside from DJGPP, FREEDOS, and the like, but ordinary users still probably can't get a handle on those very easily.
So I think right now we should simply categorize some old DOS programs (the software should be as complete as possible), then write some detailed usage instructions, TXT format is OK, and then also add some new DOS software such as DJGPP, FREEDOS, etc., then write some basic teaching materials, and also include some of CDU's articles and achievements, such as the universal boot disk, and then put it all onto one disc. Then make it bootable, and make the boot content into a system disk that can boot and directly use the contents on the CD, and can serve as an emergency disk (with a 2.88M image, quite a lot can be done).

I think this would be pretty good. As for lemonhall's (hard-to-remember name, and I copied it too, lemonhall, give us a nickname) suggestion, that can be the plan for the second CD. With the experience from the first one, it should be easier to do.

From now on just call me Lemon

I agree with doing it this way. Being too complete isn't good. Then if DJGPP is included it becomes simpler, since it has its own documentation
system INFO (its format is also plain text; PLAIN TEXT itself refers to text with some description applied)

You just need to write some simple indexes for the TEXT files, and then you can read them directly with INFO. The biggest advantages are:
1. It allows cross-references (basically hyperlinks), and it's still in a character interface, which is the most important thing
for a help system. Simple TXT can clearly describe an already integrated system.
2. It conforms to GNU standards. (At least it does now. It's said that LINUX and hackers are defining new standards so that
people working on various platforms can use one complete friendly
documentation system)

MS help files can also be used (you need a special tool to create them, and that itself isn't free, which I don't like,
and that software actually needs 650K conventional memory to run, I'm dizzy)

Let's make a list of all the files that need to be written!! Sorted by software name


=================
PS: As for the articles on the forum, I think we should still learn from GNU's approach and simply organize them into something like an FAQ.
After all, for a "new" thing (in the eyes of people who have never studied DOS and never used DOS, DOS is very new),
no matter how newbie the user is, it wouldn't be too much at all!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I don't think an e-book necessarily has to run on DOS.
In fact, with resources placed online nowadays, if after downloading them everyone still has to put them into DOS in order to use them, that seems a bit too troublesome. And there probably aren't many people going online through DOS now, right? Just like making it Windows-compatible, I don't think the effect would be too good either.
Of course, for some DOS-related tutorials, if they are to be made into an instant help system, then running under DOS would be necessary. But it seems that most of them can be simulated in the Windows environment. DOS's multitasking support also isn't very good, right?

For the current CDU, the key is still the need for good management. First stabilize the current popularity and resources, then think about market operation. To be honest, given CDU's current situation, there isn't really any good product that can be pushed onto the market, and there are deficiencies in commercial operation, management, technology, and so on.

The key now is that everyone's strength needs to be brought together. The road ahead is broad and bright, but the thorns along the way need people to clear them, and the wheels also need force behind them before they will turn... and the force needs to push in the same direction...

As for e-books, I always used to recommend making them in HLP format, so they can be read under DOS as well as under Win3.x, Win9x, and so on. But CHM format won't do.

It's not that there is no Chinese browser under DOS, but only text-mode Chinese Internet browsers, such as Lynx and the like (actually under Unix/Linux it's the same). And Lynx has a Chinese interface version (available for download on its website).

Recently I finally started using LINUX. Right now I'm using RED HAT LINUX to go online, browse CDU's webpages, and use Intelligent Pinyin
to reply to posts. Suddenly I discovered that the INTERNET is actually one big "GUI program."

A classmate actually looked at me in surprise and asked: This thing can go online too???? Can it recognize Microsoft's webpage format?

At that moment I had the urge to hit him

And I also felt immense sorrow in my heart. Microsoft............... too hateful. How many young people it has poisoned.

But every time I reboot the system, I see another kind of sorrow. LINUX simply labels WINDOWS partitions
as "DOS" (that's how it is under REDHAT; other LINUX systems aren't necessarily like that)
This labeling method somewhat also expresses the contempt LINUX users and developers have for Microsoft!!! And a bit of helplessness.

Using LINUX's character terminal and looking at webpages. Running and savoring the charm of GNU's little tools, experiencing the
other philosophical ideas told to us through PERL's infinite complexity. The longing in my heart was finally satisfied.

After that satisfaction, what I thought of was CDU's development.

Using WINDOWS did not make me, as a DOS user, give up DOS itself. In fact, I am still a loyal supporter
of WINDOWS. My favorite WINDOWS system is WIN2000. In many respects it is more compatible with DOS, more primitive.
More likely to become a hacker platform.

But only after truly coming into contact with the power of LINUX did I begin to feel disgust toward DOS; it is Microsoft's clumsy imitation.

But there is absolutely no intention here to belittle Microsoft, DOS, or WINDOWS in any way. LINUX, UNIX, DOS, WINDOWS, OS/2: I have used all of these operating systems, but the one I am most comfortable with is still DOS.

What DOS brings users is convenience under the premise of limited simplification. Comparing DOS and UNIX systems (at the user level),
the philosophical proposition I got is: limited simplification brings high efficiency (running cost, learning cost)

UNIX's famous philosophical proposition is: do one thing, and do it the best (maximize the part, and obtain the greatest possible efficiency)

LINUX's philosophical proposition has similarities with UNIX, and also this: proper combination produces the greatest benefit, plus the open-source
development model (both economically and technically)

So what CDU can do is to learn from certain things and use them to accomplish our goal.




I just want to share more of this with everyone, THE MORE THE LESS

Seeing the title of the post, I thought it meant burning CDs with DOS? I wonder when that idea can be realized :）
If possible, you could also go online with DOS. Don't say one floppy can't do it, just look at QNX -- they even have a graphical interface. Looking forward to it...

DOS is like a simplified simulator for beginners to UNIX. Although it is not as powerful and efficient as UNIX, looking back, DOS can also accomplish very many functions -- just like the DOS software under today's DOS Union, flourishing in full variety. From this one can also see the power of UNIX. More importantly, for people like us who once lived under DOS, through it we were able to discover the great charm of UNIX and thus embark on the UNIX path; it must be said that DOS laid a good foundation for us. Unfortunately Microsoft wants to abandon DOS with Windows. Now, aside from seeing the command line interface during system installation, that once familiar and intimate interface and feel can probably only be found under UNIX-like systems.

Honestly speaking, the command prompt interface really isn't very convenient. Its biggest advantage is that it's relatively stable and doesn't make errors the way a GUI does.
But the trend of development is definitely GUI.

The following is quoted from lemonhall's post on 2003-9-25 18:50:50:
Recently I finally started using LINUX. Right now I'm using RED HAT LINUX to go online, browse CDU's webpages, and use Intelligent Pinyin
to reply to posts. Suddenly I discovered that the INTERNET is actually one big "GUI program."

A classmate actually looked at me in surprise and asked: This thing can go online too???? Can it recognize Microsoft's webpage format?

At that moment I had the urge to hit him

And I also felt immense sorrow in my heart. Microsoft............... too hateful. How many young people it has poisoned.

But every time I reboot the system, I see another kind of sorrow. LINUX simply labels WINDOWS partitions
as "DOS" (that's how it is under REDHAT; other LINUX systems aren't necessarily like that)
This labeling method somewhat also expresses the contempt LINUX users and developers have for Microsoft!!! And a bit of helplessness.

Using LINUX's character terminal and looking at webpages. Running and savoring the charm of GNU's little tools, experiencing the
other philosophical ideas told to us through PERL's infinite complexity. The longing in my heart was finally satisfied.

After that satisfaction, what I thought of was CDU's development.

Using WINDOWS did not make me, as a DOS user, give up DOS itself. In fact, I am still a loyal supporter
of WINDOWS. My favorite WINDOWS system is WIN2000. In many respects it is more compatible with DOS, more primitive.
More likely to become a hacker platform.

But only after truly coming into contact with the power of LINUX did I begin to feel disgust toward DOS; it is Microsoft's clumsy imitation.

But there is absolutely no intention here to belittle Microsoft, DOS, WINDOWS, or anything else. LINUX, UNIX, DOS, WINDOWS, OS/2. I have used all of these operating systems, but the one I am most comfortable with is still DOS.

What DOS brings users is convenience under the premise of limited simplification. Comparing DOS and UNIX systems (at the user level),
the philosophical proposition I got is: limited simplification brings high efficiency (running cost, learning cost)

UNIX's famous philosophical proposition is: do one thing, and do it the best (maximize the part, and obtain the greatest possible efficiency)

LINUX's philosophical proposition has similarities with UNIX, and also this: proper combination produces the greatest benefit, plus the open-source
development model (both economically and technically)

So what CDU can do is to learn from certain things and use them to accomplish our goal.




I just want to share more of this with everyone, THE MORE THE LESS

Hehe, LINUX really is quite good, and DOS is also very familiar and dear to me. I also think 2000 is the best work in the WIN series, but they are all just operating systems, each with its own strengths and uses. As for Microsoft, I don't have a favorable impression of it, but not to the point of contempt.

As for: "A classmate actually looked at me in surprise and asked: This thing can go online too???? Can it recognize Microsoft's webpage format?"
Hehe, I think most people started using computers with M$'s stuff, right? (Maybe things will be better later, but that doesn't matter to people just starting to use computers.) Because of first impressions, they think M$'s stuff is what a computer is, and that's also very normal. This also shows M$'s success in certain areas; at least in terms of users, they've done very well.

The following is quoted from lemonhall's post on 2003-9-25 18:50:50:
Recently I finally started using LINUX. Right now I'm using RED HAT LINUX to go online, browse CDU's webpages, and use Intelligent Pinyin
to reply to posts. Suddenly I discovered that the INTERNET is actually one big "GUI program."

A classmate actually looked at me in surprise and asked: This thing can go online too???? Can it recognize Microsoft's webpage format?

At that moment I had the urge to hit him

And I also felt immense sorrow in my heart. Microsoft............... too hateful. How many young people it has poisoned.

But every time I reboot the system, I see another kind of sorrow. LINUX simply labels WINDOWS partitions
as "DOS" (that's how it is under REDHAT; other LINUX systems aren't necessarily like that)
This labeling method somewhat also expresses the contempt LINUX users and developers have for Microsoft!!! And a bit of helplessness.

Using LINUX's character terminal and looking at webpages. Running and savoring the charm of GNU's little tools, experiencing the
other philosophical ideas told to us through PERL's infinite complexity. The longing in my heart was finally satisfied.

After that satisfaction, what I thought of was CDU's development.

Using WINDOWS did not make me, as a DOS user, give up DOS itself. In fact, I am still a loyal supporter
of WINDOWS. My favorite WINDOWS system is WIN2000. In many respects it is more compatible with DOS, more primitive.
More likely to become a hacker platform.

But only after truly coming into contact with the power of LINUX did I begin to feel disgust toward DOS; it is Microsoft's clumsy imitation.

But there is absolutely no intention here to belittle Microsoft, DOS, WINDOWS, or anything else. LINUX, UNIX, DOS, WINDOWS, OS/2. I have used all of these operating systems, but the one I am most comfortable with is still DOS.

What DOS brings users is convenience under the premise of limited simplification. Comparing DOS and UNIX systems (at the user level),
the philosophical proposition I got is: limited simplification brings high efficiency (running cost, learning cost)

UNIX's famous philosophical proposition is: do one thing, and do it the best (maximize the part, and obtain the greatest possible efficiency)

LINUX's philosophical proposition has similarities with UNIX, and also this: proper combination produces the greatest benefit, plus the open-source
development model (both economically and technically)

So what CDU can do is to learn from certain things and use them to accomplish our goal.




I just want to share more of this with everyone, THE MORE THE LESS

Saying that MS has poisoned many young people is not entirely correct. Not everyone is interested in computer systems. They just want to go online, listen to MP3s, and play online games, and they already feel that's great. There are reasons why MS dominates the PC OS market. Just looking at XP now, from installation to application, MS is completely very user-friendly. LINUX already loses by a big margin just on installation alone. So MS is not entirely just poisoning people.

Seeing everyone post so many comments on my shallow impressions, I'm really very grateful

As for LINUX installation, that problem is basically solved now. In fact, when I installed REDHAT9 on the school's 20 machines,
the only thing I configured manually was the IP address; everything else was automatic, and
all the hardware was recognized too.
This is very much like 2000 and XP, and it also has an HCL (hardware compatibility list). What is especially praiseworthy in the end
is that REDHAT9's installation interface is just too friendly; the installation starts right away in 800*600 high resolution.

As for multimedia and games, these are not LINUX's main development direction after all, so debating this
doesn't have that much meaning (but I was very glad to see that after REDHAT was installed, I could already listen to MP3s and watch DVDs.
But games like CS and WAR3 were out of the question, and it took me an entire afternoon to get QQ installed, dizzy)

I'm not here to do off-topic posting just to promote LINUX. In fact, I am expressing my own path of growth.

Some time ago, using DJGPP let me glimpse the power of UNIX systems through DOS, and in the process of learning PERL, I truly
realized that C is as easy to use and learn as BASIC. (Of course, PERL is absolutely not PERL.)

Finally, when using a text editor (TDE5), I found that it only supported long filename calls under WIN95 (this
also has something to do with it being compiled with DJGPP2。01). In a fit of anger, I found its source code and rewrote
three of its file functions, wrote a macro for it with operations similar to NOTEPAD, and also made some
extensions to its menu commands. After compiling successfully under DJGPP2。03, it ran very well on my 486, with very powerful functions, letting me get rid of
the cumbersome process of first exiting TDE, then running MAKE, then entering TDE again to edit,
and instead simply use the F7 key to get everything done.

All this is a kind of joy you can't enjoy when programming by yourself alone. DJGPP let me experience the
power of open source code for the first time.

So I reread "Collected Essays on Open Source Software," trying to grasp the spirit of GNU and OPEN SOURCE more accurately.
On the third day, when I got hold of that book, I decided to delete WINXP and install LINUX instead.